the room of requirement

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UnbirthdayGirl
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:54 am    Post subject: the room of requirement Reply with quote

i don't understand the room of requirement. what would happen if there were 2 people with completely different reasons for accessing the room... one was already inside, doing his thing. would the other person be able to get inside??? am i missing something?
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afterthree
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, actually. That's why Ginny had to leave the Room of Requirement in Deathly Hallows before Harry could get into the other version of it. So long as someone is in it, that's what the room is, and then only those who want the "same" room can get in and out. Once it's "taken shape", that's the shape it is. It won't become a different room until it's empty again and someone else wills it to be something different.
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WinglessFlight
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, slightly different question. If the Founder's built Hogwarts, we can safely assume that they created the Room of Requirement. Why doesn't someone whose powers equal theirs (i.e. DUMBLEDORE) just make another one?

Also,why did no-one say to the room 'I need an entire universe without Voldemort' and just go live in the room forever?
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niki56
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK ANGEL.

*points out that this IS children's fiction*

Maybe there is limits on the R of R.

Maybe the levels of magic in the world is slowly depleting.

IDK. I have thought about some weird things, but this has never occured to me yet. Interesting. :D
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afterthree
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, JKR makes it pretty clear that Dumbledore *didn't* know about the Room of Requirement. He stumbled upon a room filled with chamberpots that he could never find again, but in DH, JKR says (via Harry) that Dumbledore didn't know about the RoR, and that's why Voldemort so cockily hid the Diadem there.

And why would you want two? One is generally enough, I think. It leads to the whole, "why isn't *every* room in the school like that, then?" argument, which gets silly.

I think the room is constrained to be a *room*. I don't think you can create a universe. You could, hypothetically, create a *room* without Voldemort. But I think the magic restricts it to a room, not an infinite set of rooms or universe.
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ChristyCorr
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also... Angel, what would be the use of an insanely large room/large set of rooms without Voldemort?

*scratches head* Unless you're planning on hiding everyone in the world in there, it's useless (not to mention cowardly). Plus, even so, Voldemort evidently wouldn't be able to enter, but his minions would (once instructions on how to access it become common knowledge, and that would certainly happen)... It would therefore be a moot point, yeah?
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Crystalline
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Asides from that, I don't know if Dumbly's power equaled the Founders' but that is irrelevant, and I think Hogwarts has a magic of its own. Pfft, from the ground of the rocks it was built on/by or whatever. One of the shiftier ones, much as Salazar did, may have inserted it in there to do... what it needed to? I suspect Rowena maybe, to come up with nifty spells or quietr study time etc.

I have lost my point.
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ChristyCorr
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, Dumbledore did say that Hogwarts is a stronghold of ancient magic...
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WinglessFlight
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know. I guess if I were Harry, the first thing I would've done is go to the RoR and be all 'I need a Room with all of Voldemort's Horcruxes in it.'
Which, I'm sure, is impossible by JKR's ever-present excuse 'Oh, don't worry, there are LIMITS set to appear every time we work out a not-ridiculous way for Harry to do things!'

*snark*
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ToxicLemons
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe the Room can't make things appear - like food and Horcruxes. But if you were like, "Yo, I need to know how to destroy Horcruxes (Hocruxi?)" then it would transform to give you books on the Horcruxes/i. Doesn't it happen in Book 5, with the DA?

Poor Harry. Never thought to use the freaking room.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's 'Horcruxes.' And yes, the Room could definitely supply books about them--but Harry had no access to it in DH until it was too late, yeah? Plus, Dumbledore left them Summon-able in his office anyway *shrugs*

And Angel, the Room can conjure things, but I don't think it could be that specific--it wouldn't be able to Summon the Horcruxes from their hiding places, yeah? So it could, at best, duplicate them, which would be ... not good at all.
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afterthree
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was established in DH that the Room of Requirement couldn't "create" food -- that's why Neville and the DA that were hiding in there had to go to the Hog's Head and *get* food. Food is an exception to some kind of transfiguration rule, according to Hermione and her books.

I'm pretty sure Voldemort would have made his Horcruxes "unsummonable". I don't think the Room of Requirement can break any magical rules -- like how it can't create food. I think it probably follows and adheres to all the rules of Transfiguration -- whatever they might be.
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ChristyCorr
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Voldemort did do that to his Horcruxes--at least with the locket!
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afterthree
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, exactly. Just like how, when Harry was trying to see what Malfoy was up to in HBP, the room wouldn't let him in. It only answers to very specific requests, like "I need that room where I hid that thing that time", not "I need to get into whatever room Malfoy is frolicking in right now". So asking it to show you "a room with all of Voldemort's Horcruxes in it" would probably yield the same results -- nadda.
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WinglessFlight
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why would the Founders create a room that could turn into anything...apart from things that you might <i>actually need?</i>

Potter illogicalities bug me weirdly.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think it's illogical. I just think there are rules with magic (like with science) that can't be broken. I'm also not sure the Room of Requirement was created intentionally by any one specific person or group of people -- I'm more inclined to think of it as just another side effect of a building built with magic housing a lot of magic. It may have been -- somewhat like Voldemort's cursing of the DA position or the passing of James Potter's unruly hair to his son -- an unintentional magical occurance.

The "magic" of the Room is largely transfiguration in nature. Therefore it should follow JKR's transfiguration "rules" in her universe, should it not? There are other considerations as well -- such as the protective enchantments Voldemort would have placed on his Horcruxes that would prevent such magical "calling" of these items -- there's apparating and disapparating, but to our knowledge there's no precident for "apparating" or "disapparating" an item from a distance into your waiting hands *other* than summoning charms, which Voldemort had obviously put protection against. Plus the room isn't "sentient" enough to "summon" something. I think it just transfigures matter and space.

The abilities and limitations of the Room all seem quite logical and consistent with the universe to me. I think JKR was always very conscious of not making magic a "quick fix" almost all of the time in the books (the Accio charm notwithstanding) -- one of the central thematic elements of the story entire is that, with all this magical power at these people's disposal, they *still* have the same personal, societal, and moral problems Muggles do. They can repair a broken vase, but they can't bring someone back to life or re-grow Moody's leg. Obviously, some things (like the Room of Requirement) are nothing more than cleverly disguised (or not so cleverly disguised, depending on your opinion) plot devices. We should be careful not to split hairs.
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